MCITP: Windows 7, Enterprise Desktop Support Technician certification update

Having looked at the HDI exam, unless MS publishes a book for us MCP's to use to pass the exam it is a non-starter for me. I see absolutely no value in this exam and have never seen it listed as a requirement for any tech job I have seen during my career. The biggest turnoff is that there is no 3rd party material, your only choice is to take one of their expensive classes or take the test with no preparation.

MSlearn, you really dropped the ball on this one by publishing info months ago that you now appear to be rapidly backpedaling on and where all traces of the HDI exam have been removed from the MCP learning portal pages. You of all people should know that in this economy poeple don't have the money for this. Make the right decision and remove the HDI exam from the requirements. If you feel a soft skills test is desireable, try A+ which most people already have or would be useful by itself to people who don't already have it.

Dan

Hey Dan,
how is giving early information that might change a bad thing? The fact that they give early information at all is a good thing. People should realize that Beta information means subject to change. Life is like that, if you get early info it might not be the final info. And you dont have to get the certification if it will not do you any good. No one is forcing anyone to take an exam.
No information has yet been released if this certification is required for an MCT to teach any courses.
No final information has been released as to the final target audience for the certification.
Things change in Beta phases, anyone who doesn't get that needs to get away from taking beta exams and just wait for things to go live.

I am pretty sure that no one out in MSL made the changes just to screw with any individual person, why would they bother. If you see no value in the exam, don't take it.

Just my two cents

Bill

I passed 680 and 685, they show up in my transcript but no MCITP.
Will i receive my mcitp certificate, by passing these exams if the beta is becoming regular?
Wat kind of additional requirements would be nessasarydfff, are they also from Microsoft or your new partner?

LOL. Another fail. Typical MSLearn style. First you have told one will need stupid 200$ HDI exam also. Looks that you have realized that no one would pay for that - I have seen opinions from more than dozen persons that have passed beta of 685 - no one I repeat NO ONE from them would pay that much for stupid windows client exam.

So typical for MSLearn - make [stupid] decision without thinking about consequences.

Hope there won't be third Bus Tour this year and maybe MSLearn will find some time to fix some stupid decision made in a rush to pollute earth with pointless Bus Tours.

I wonder how is that possible that after so many failed decisions we haven't heard about flying chairs and fired managers in MSLearn...

Hello,
I'm a MCSE for Windows Server 2003 and I wan't to update my certification to MCITP: Windows Server 2008 Enterprise Admin. I have already passed 70-647 and now i'm preparing for 70-649. I think that it doesn't make sense to learn for a vista exam (70-620 or 70-624) to get the Enterprise Administrator Certification, now that Windows 7 is released. Is it possible to take one of the Win 7 Exams instead of the Vista for getting the Windows Server 2008 Enterprise Administrator certification?

Another good question is: are there chances that MCSA/MCSE +M will be updated to newer MS Exchanges. MCSA/E +M is based on Exchange 2003 - wonder how no one noticed that there are two newer versions of Exchange. It is more strange because +S is updated and includes newer ISA 2006.

I'm not sure what you're complaining about, except just to complain. The MCSA+M and MCSE+M were still System Administrator or System Engineer certs. It just means that they took a messaging exam for their elective. It's basically saying that you have the MCSA/MCSE skillset, and you know some Exchange.

In the new generation certs they are broken out by job roles. Someone with an MCSA+M or MCSE+M can upgrade their core certification (Systems Administrator or Systems Engineer) to the 2008 version of the certs by taking the 70-648 (MCSA) or 70-649 (MCSE) exams and the appropriate PRO exam (70-646 for Server Administrators and 70-647 for Enterprise Administrators).

If someone has an MCSA+M or MCSE+M and they want to get an MCITP for messaging then they have to start the messaging-specific MCITP track. There is no upgrade path from an MCSA/MCSE to MCITP: Enterprise Messaging Adminsitrator because they are two completely different skillsets.

It wasn't complain it was question. MCSA/MCSE[+S] path is updated with MCTS certs for ISA 2006, Vista and Windows 7. Isn't it strange that +M is left with only Exchange 2003, while we have Exchange 2010 now. For me it is... Why +S was updated and +M isn't?

You pass 70-236 and, if you are MCSE: M, you will be (ta-da!): MCSE:M AND TS: Exchange 2007, Configuring technology specialist. Same thing as MCSE:S AND TS: ISA 2006.

Who says everyone should have MCITP: EDST? Why even bother to go for a beta if you don't want to pursue cert to the end? You don't enroll at college and then complain that you don't need some classes or that there is no real-life value in that. You don't buy a car and then complain that your favourite color is discontinued after five years or that steering wheel isn't elliptical.
You either accept and go for it and be the best possible professional you can or go after something else.

"You pass 70-236 and, if you are MCSE: M, you will be (ta-da!): MCSE:M AND TS: Exchange 2007, Configuring technology specialist. Same thing as MCSE:S AND TS: ISA 2006."

You are right that one can be MCSE+S with MCTS ISA 2006. The problem is there is no way to be MCSE+M with anything else than Exchange 2003.

There are three Exchange Server 2007 exams:
70-236 TS:Exchange Server 2007, Configuring
When you successfully pass this exam you will earn the MCTS: Microsoft Exchange Server 2007 – Configuration certification.

70-237 Pro: Designing Messaging Solutions with Microsoft Exchange Server 2007
70-238 Pro: Deploying Messaging Solutions with Microsoft Exchange Server 2007

Once you successfully pass all three exams you will earn the MCITP: Enterprise Messaging Administrator certification.
http://www.microsoft.com/learning/en/us/certifi...

Walter Boyd
Senior Product Manager
ITPro Certifications

That is not an answer for my question - I know MS Certs Paths. The Question is: Why MCSE+M isn't updated with 2007/2010 Exchange exams. MCSE(+M) is updated with Vista/Windows 7/ISA 2006 MCTS exams.

MCSE+M is specific to Exchange 2000 and Exchange 2003 running on Windows 2000 or Windows 2003. Exchange 2007 has two very specific certifications for TS and ITPro. It would be confusing to have both ITPro: Exchange Messaging Administrator and a rapidly aging (at almost 7 years old) MCSE+M as Exchange 2007 certs. Exchange 2010 isn't even physically possible on Windows 2003.

Walter Boyd
Senior Product Manager
ITPro Certifications

Yes, you can take 70-680 instead of one of the Vista exams. It is documented here:

http://www.microsoft.com/learning/en/us/certifi...

I don't think there is any need to be abusive is there "me"?

The reason for this (i believe) is that the HDI exams are not available in the UK and I think quite a lot of Europe. I don't really think that Microsoft can be blamed for a third parties failure to propogate their certifications outside of the US (unless you again point out that they live in a very US-centric bubble where certifications are concerned and are often guilty of failure to fully take into account their decisions affects outside of the US).

Whilst you slag off the bus tour, the above may not have come to light if it were not for a conversation had with Liberty on the very same bus tour you think was a waste of time.

Alonder are you saying that it was HDI that forced MSLearn to include their exams in this Certication? If MS decided to include HDI as partner then MSLearn is responsible for partner and whole cert path. So I blame MSLearn.

About Bus Tours - I would like to know how much pollution was done with two Buses and all those km/miles. If you follow this blog you should know that MSlearn discontinued plastic wallet cards to save our planet...

Im going to be pretty pissed off if the HDI requirement is removed from the MCITP EDST 7 stuff. I purposely did not do the 70-685 in beta because I did not plan on doing the ridiculous HDI requirement later on, so if its removed then that screws me on doing the beta and ultimately helping MS with the material.

Now i'll have to pay for the upgrade exam if I want to renew that cert, because of misleading/false information.

Who wants to shoot me a free exam voucher?

I think there is confusion around MCITP: EDST7 (with HDI) and the MCITP:EDA7 that we talked about in this thread when we announced HDI - http://borntolearn.mslearn.net/2009/07/microsof...

I'll check up on it and see what's going on.

No confusion.

I am aware of both paths, and I did take the 70-686 in beta. I skipped the 70-685 because I was not planning on taking the HDI cert to complete the MCITP: EDST 7 (not eda), because i think its ridiculous. Now the plans have apparently changed for EDST 7, and if all I end up needing is the 685 then I will be upset at the fact that the info changed after the fact.

I can still take the 682 upgrade, but thats beside the point.

Got it - the post is basically confirming that 680 and 685 are going to be requirements and that the whole list will be released in December. Given that we partnered with HDI (and I haven't heard to the contrary), the HDI requirement for this certification will not go away.

But I do think that people think they are forced to doing the HDI cert for anything MCITP Windows 7. There will be a MCITP: EDA7 - The EDST7 is primarily intended for support technicians in a help desk capacity and not just all IT Pros. This is not your only option.

I appreciate the quick and concise respnse, Erwin. I did take the 686 and am anxiously awaiting those results as well. At this point, im probably past needing to take the EDST 7 stuff anyway, as I have proven myself again and again on the desktop stuff. The EDA7 I do plan on getting and hopefully will have it with a beta pass.

Thanks again.

A lot of people wanted to take the 70-685 and/or 70-686 betas and couldn't get a seat, myself included, so you should be glad you grabbed a seat fast enough on 71-686 to at least have one of them.

I took necessary steps to ensure that I got into the betas I wanted to be into.

I think 680 had record interest, but I woke up at midnight the day it became available to sign up. I also filled out an SME profile and got early notification of 71-686.

If you follow the B2L or BetaExam blogs you will always get plenty of fair notice to sign up for them, so you missing it is by noones fault but your own.

Not trying to be rude, just honest.

Your last comment isn't exactly accurate. I follow bot Born2Learn and the Beta exam blog, but by the time I say that 71-686 was in beta it was already filled. Granted, I'm only checking those sites once or twice a day, but still. I could easily see someone in a much later timezone never getting the chance to sign up for the beta.

Besides, the beta signup process has changed recently. They pull the first group based on their MSL/Connect profile and send invites, and then only after that do they post on Born 2 Learn and the Beta Exam Blog. If they get enough responses to their invites then there may be very few (or no) spots open to the general public.

My comment is accurate.

The beta opened the same time for everyone, but those with an SME profile were just NOTIFIED earlier than some others. But plenty of non SME people also signed up with plenty of space to spare. They also increased the capacity of the betas several times, as with 71-680.

If you dont position yourself to ensure that you get in the beta, thats noones fault but your own. Fact.

Don't cry in your own spilled milk, if you chose not to take a (free) beta exam and would be 'pissed' if later they removed the requirement and you could've gotten an additional 'free' item because of it, that's your own fault. Don't try to spin it as if it's Microsoft missing out on your great wealth of knowledge because they changed something without running it past you, or that you are ENTITLED to a second shot at a freebie.

While I can see why you might be frustrated, I'm a little confused on the "free exam voucher". You had an opportunity to take an MS exam for free while it was in beta, but passed on it. Now you want to take the exam, but because you passed on it when it was in beta you feel like you should get it for free now?

Beta exams aren't a right or a privilege, they're just an opportunity that is out there. Loads of people wanted to take the exam but couldn't get registered in time. Does that mean that they are entitled to a free exam too?

Call me crazy, but I always take every beta exam that I that is available if it is related to my career path in some way. Maybe I'll choose not to pursue the higher-level cert later, but get it while it's free now.

Speaking of which, are there still plans to have an MCITP level cert around system center or virtualization?

Yes for virtualization, not sure for system center.

Because we were all misinformed.

I consider myself at or near the SME level for desktop systems and as such I think microsoft benefits from me participating in betas, as much as I enjoy getting the exam for free.

I simply would like MS learning to get their information straight before releasing it to the public. They routinely miss deadlines and change info after the fact, and it can get pretty frustrating. I hold a lot of MS Certifications and take a lot of pride in obtaining them, but getting incorrect information makes that more difficult, costly, and time consuming than it needs to be.

In fact, you are asking about the MCITP: Virtualization Administrator path that i've been trying to get information about for months, but its like pulling teeth. I finally got Ken to let me know that there will be 3 tests in the path. Im guessing 2 MCTS' and an MCITP.

Yeah - I understand your frustration and I too am frustrated that we don't have more information to give you. If it were up to me, I would give you guys an insider view at the certs we're planning.

However, we don't release information like that because of the very problem you have - changing information. We make a lot of adjustments and changes during the cert development process and we wait until everything is confirmed before we release the information so that you don't have to hit a moving target.

I can confirm Erwin's comments regarding MCITP: EDST7. Exams 680 and 685 absolutely will be requirements for this certification. Additional requirements or options are still being finalized. As such I cannot confirm, or even comment on, the final requirements until they are ... well ... final.

I understand that's not a great answer at this point. As soon as we get t's crossed and i's dotted we will post the full Windows 7 certification paths.

Walter Boyd
Senior Product Manager
ITPro Certifications

Speaking of moving targets, does Microsoft have any plans to continue the HDI certification path in future desktop releases? Will "Windows 8" have a path that would benefit from the HDI certification? I realize that it's a total guessing game currently, but any thoughts?

I for one would be more interested in the "extra" certification if I knew that it was going to be used in future releases by Microsoft. You give CompTIA and the SSCP or CISSP certs much credit by including them as electives in the MCSA+S and MCSE+S tracks.

<LOL>
Correct. That would be a total guessing game at this point. Let's see what happens after we finish with the Windows 7 certs first.

As for HDI - they have several certifications that specifically recognize soft skills capabilities. That is a transferable skill set that will follow you forever.

Walter Boyd
Senior Product Manager
ITPro Certifications

Only three exams for a MCITP: Virtualization Administrator cert? Total shot in the dark here, but I'm assuming that would be Hyper-V, System Center VMM, and a yet to be devised Pro exam. That would be awesome since I've already knocked out the two MCTS exams related to virtualization.

Hey Jordus,
why would the folks who are planning on doing psychometric profiling of answers and test takers care if you are at the SME level. Much like I have told to MCT's that they are not always the target audience, you as an SME might not be the target audience. The exams are designed to test a minimally qualified candidate who could do the job that is being tested for. Experts throw the curve off which can skew the results so that the exam might not be targetted at the right final audience.
If you dont get to take a particular beta is not a really big deal, take it when it goes live.
If the beta process frustrates you, wait and take the live exam.
There is really no benefit to taking the exam early other than bragging rights that you got it first.
I have taken tons of beta exams and tons of regular exams. they all count for the same in the end on the transcript.
I recommend that you wait a month or two after they come out with the live exam, at that point you can be pretty sure that the information out there is correct. Beta means pre-release which means it can and will change.

Just my two cents

Bill

Hopefully the information on the MCDST upgrade exam (70-682) will be available soon! :) And hopefully so will the results of the 686 beta

No HDI for me either

I had passed on the 685 as well. :(

I passed the beta exam, hopefully there won't be a HDI requirement for the cert. If there is Microsoft Learning definately should put a exam prep book out, or make it optional in place of this exam with 70-680.

Will we be seeing the requirements for the Win7 EDA come out at the same time as the EDST?

Can you tell me what the upgrade offering will be? I have upgraded my MCDST to MCITP: EST - will there be a similar upgrade exam to bring MCITP: EST up to MCITP: EST7?

I am very displeased by the HDI requirement. Employers are quickly able to determine the people-side skills, and this is a technical skill assessment from Microsoft. I don't see any people-side skills for any other top-tier certification, so I am unsure why this one is deemed to need that requirement. Interviewers are looking for who will fit their team. MS doesn't need to supplement that.

Beyond that, the HDI requirements are quite excessive in price for that certification. Passing the two MS exams are just a little over what their one exam runs. Many employers act like you are pulling teeth to pay the $125 exam cost, so when I saw the much higher cost to take the HDI class an exam, there is no way I would go for it. For most of that cost, you can be well on your way to a server-side certification, which has a much better salary ROI than a desktop technician.

Any updates on what has been decided on or when we can expect this to be released?

I am definately interested ni the upgrade path. I have my server 2008 certs.

The HDI exam requirement is unreasonable unless MS or another 3rd party makes some affordable training material, and unless the exorbitant HDI exam price is lowered to the same price as an MS exam.

Hi there

Any update about the requirements of MCITP: Windows 7, Enterprise Desktop Support Technician certification ? 4 days left before the end of 2009. I would like to know whether I can be EDST 7 or not just by passing 70-680 and 70-685.

Can someone kindly follow up with this issue ???

"Additional requirements will be announced by the end of December 2009. Upgrade requirements have not been determined yet and will be announced at the same time."

FAIL!

My Company has implimented a requirement that all of our Helpdesk Staff are to obtain the level of Enterprise Desktop Support Technician (70-685). I as their trainer have to cert first, however I can find NO study material or ANY reference to an ETA. I am unable to find any MOC Material from the MCT Download certer either. I have to agree with Dan's posting below. Can ANYONE please recommend ANY study resources for this cert? MS: has just fallen flat on it's communication about 70-685.

Ian Estey
MCP, MCDST, MCTS, MCITP, MCT

The CW Library course 50331A is now available for prepping the 70-685 exam.

Hello!

I am the trainer for a company who has just implemented a requirement that all the Helpdesk staff will obtain the Enterprise Desktop Support Technican certification (70-685). I as their trainer have to certify first (and soon) however the communication from MSL on this ticket is very sub-par.

I am unable to find ANY legit (non Testking type material) for 70-685 from MS-Press, Sybex, MeasureUP or the MCT Download Center and there is NO communication as to an ETA. (although MSL refers to course: 50331A, I cannot find it ANYWHERE on the MCT site)!

So, Two questions and a comment:

1. Can ANYONE recommend ANY study material for 70-685 (I have already passed 70-680)
2. If not, can ANYONE offer any areas of focus not offered in the "Skills Measured" section of the MSL webpage for this cert.

And my Comments:

MSL should open the lines of communication for this exam! It is quite appearent that little is known by the very people who will be training for the certification! I wrote my first Cert in 97' and have never encountered such difficulty learning about a cert!

Thank you,

Ian Estey

MCP, MCDST, MCTS, MCITP, MCT

Sorry for the delay, but the 50331A course material is now available from the CW Library site. If you decide to use the manual, please feel free to let me know what you think.

Hi

Do we have an update/ETA on the requirements to obtain the MCITP:EDST7?

Thanks